Resilience, Reinvention and the Monument Method

Reza Ghaemi: Hello, hello, hello. Welcome to the Res Podcast, the show where we explore ideas, habits, and conversations that help us grow, think differently, and live more intentionally. I'm your host, Reza Gayemi. ⁓ life doesn't always go according to plan. At some point, we all face challenges, whether it's in our careers, our relationships, our health, or simply realizing that the life we imagine isn't the one we're living. The real question is when life forces you to start over, how do you rebuild? That's exactly what we're exploring in today's episode. Joining me today is Galen Wilson, a relationship coach whose own journey is a powerful example of resilience, reinvention, and personal growth. Through some of life's toughest challenges, he's developed a unique perspective on overcoming adversity, building emotional resilience, and creating stronger, healthier relationships. In today's conversation, we're going to explore why people get stuck, what it really takes to create lasting change, how our mindset shapes our future. And the practical habits and perspectives that can help us navigate life's biggest challenges. Whether you're looking to improve your relationships, overcome obstacles, or simply become the best version of yourself, I think you'll find something valuable in today's conversation. So without further ado, Galen, welcome to the Res podcast.

Gaylen Wilson: it's a pleasure being here. Thanks so much for having me.

Reza Ghaemi: It's my pleasure, Galen. Thank you so much for being here. ⁓ Galen, I just ⁓ so I've I've seen your ⁓ read your story. You've described your life as a series of forced reinventions. What were some of the biggest moments when life made you start over?

Gaylen Wilson: Mm-hmm. Okay. Well I I bas I got married at twenty. Had four kids by the time I was twenty-six. So we were we were really busy. ⁓ I also started farming at twenty three. ⁓ and so the first few years of that ⁓ endeavor were really good. I was making more money than most twenty somethings in rural Colorado. ⁓ And and I was supporting my family great and but then two of the last three years were drought years, so I didn't have a crop. So I I had a drought year, had a good crop, and then had a drought year. And that third that second drought year just did me in. And so I ended up having to file far farm bankruptcy ⁓ from that. And even though it wasn't my fault, I was the ⁓ type A driven type of personality that took it on as my I internalized it as my fault. And but I didn't have any tools to deal with that horrendous disappointment because I had I loved farming. And and and so it what I did was the good old Southeast Colorado cowboy thing and stuffed it. And you know, kind of the British thing, keep the stiff stiff upper lip and go on. And so ⁓ so I worked at some ⁓ minimum wage jobs. My wife and I both got had to get minimum wage jobs to try to survive. And of course you you don't support a family of four on two minimum wage jobs. It just just doesn't happen. And so I eventually decided, hey, I gotta go to Denver and make my make my fortune. And so believe it or not, I got a job as a stockbroker. yeah. I and I had been taking some college courses in business and and and farmers aren't given enough credit for how ⁓ much of a businessman they have to be. And so I I took to the took to the ⁓ stockbroker business great. The th the ⁓ New Yorkers seem to love my my southeast Colorado accent and my laid back attitude and and so I was doing pr really well at it and then one Monday morning in mid-January of 1990 I walked into work and I had been selling a little dental HMO to all of my clients. I had three thousand dollars of my mother's money in it. ⁓ the financials just looked so amazing. Well they were lying on their financials.

Reza Ghaemi: Sally. I know.

Gaylen Wilson: And I walked in and they had filed chapter seven ⁓ the the previous Friday. And so, of course, the stock is zero worthless. None of my clients would talk to me. My mother barely talked to me. And so I can name that as the day that I crawled inside a vodka bottle for ten years. ⁓ because I didn't have, again, didn't have the tools to deal with that emotional disaster. And I picked a really bad tool to deal with it. And ⁓ and so I was a very high functioning alcoholic. I could, you know, I I would come home from work, drink until I passed out, get up the next morning, take a couple of drinks to get me stabilized, and off to work I'd go. And ⁓ That for the first ⁓ seven or eight years of that that that worked pretty good, but then I got it kept getting worse and worse and was started losing jobs and and so ⁓ I I was in a job that had really good benefits, so I was able to get into into rehab and and get ⁓ get some tools in my toolbox, as it were. And so

Reza Ghaemi: way, this was in ten years. So sorry, describe the timeline again, how when you went to rehab.

Gaylen Wilson: Okay, this was yeah, this was the late nineties when I got into rehab. Late nineties.

Reza Ghaemi: Late nineties. Okay. Okay. And what what made you get I missed the part where like what actually kind of motivated you to get make that step? Take that step.

Gaylen Wilson: Well, i i it was it it was another one of those happy little accidents is the guy that does the paintings says. I I had gotten a I had gotten a job with a cell phone company and had worked my way up inside of it to where I was administrating their customer relationship management software. The the soft software that would record the calls when the customers would call in. And so

Reza Ghaemi: Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: ⁓ I was in a little bitty department. Somehow they had me in the reporting and analysis department. And so there were just two other guys and me. And they they were both doing the reporting and analysis. And and so they I had let them know that I was an alcoholic. And so one night they they had a team building, ⁓ saying at PF Chang's

Reza Ghaemi: Yep. Okay. Yep.

Gaylen Wilson: And so I was running a little late to it, and I got there, and the first thing they did was shove a a glass of beer into my hands. And whoops. And so by the time I'd had two or three beers with them, you know, I I did it because, you know, I wanted to be a team player. And and so by the time I had two or three beers, ⁓ On the way home, sure enough, it would tr had triggered me back into drinking, so I stopped and got me a big bottle of vodka and and so I got to going back to drinking again and I got bad enough really fast that I was drinking at work and And ⁓ and got drunk enough one afternoon that everybody noticed. And so they I got called into HR and when I told them that story, they go, ⁓ shit, we're liable for this. And so they were glad to send me to rehab and and make sure I had my job when I came back. And and so so it you know, again it was a bad thing, but

Reza Ghaemi: Interesting. Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: it turned it out to be a good thing. And so I started going to Alcoholics Anonymous and I had problems with Alcohol Anony Alcoholics Anonymous. It seemed to my me that those they were a bunch of guys white knuckling their their sobriety.

Reza Ghaemi: Yep, yep, okay.

Gaylen Wilson: You know, when you can say I've been sober four thousand three hundred and seventy two days, you're kinda obsessing about it instead of actually dealing with the the underlying issues. And the final final straw for me was there was a a twenty one ⁓ an army vet in a wheelchair that had been sober for twenty one years. And I I was actually thinking about asking him to be my sponsor. You know, in AA you ask people to be your sp

Reza Ghaemi: Yes, exactly. Agreed. Yep, I'm familiar with AA, yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Okay. And so ⁓ so one Monday mor Monday evening I walk in the meeting and he had they announced that he had fallen off the wagon over the weekend and drank himself to death. Yeah. And so i i I s you know, that was kind of the end of of my attempt at AA and and so

Reza Ghaemi: No way.

Gaylen Wilson: I fortunately I landed on my feet and found a really obscure book called Rational Recovery. And Rational Recovery taught me that alcohol had gone into my primal brain and made itself an instinct, just like your need for wood food or water or sex. And and in fact in a lot of cases it makes itself a stronger instinct than those other three. A lot of times you'll the alcoholic will forego all the other three just so he gets his alcohol. And so that's what makes it so hard when a guy starts to try to get sober. You know, once he sobers up, that little little instinct is going, dude, you're gonna die. ⁓ throws him into fight or flight to go get that alcohol to to keep the body from dying because that's what the instinct thinks is gonna happen. And so once I learned that, I was all of a sudden able to start using my higher brain function to overrule that. You know, hey, you're okay, we are not gonna die. And and so I got to the point in the late nineties, early two thousands where I was ⁓ I was staying sober for like six months at a time and then having a weekend binge once in a while. And ⁓ and so I actually didn't ever get in trouble with any of those weekend binges, fortunately. And so I in in January of two thousand one I actually got a a high-paying job as a traveling computer consultant for the company that had built the software that I had been administrating for for the cell phone company. And and so I started traveling for them, going on projects and and again, most money I'd ever made in my life. And ⁓ and so That was January 2001. We were well, we all remember what happened happened in September. Those planes flew into the building and those buildings went down in ashes, and so did that whole consulting industry. It just the the jobs just disappeared. So I got laid off by December. I spent the next nine months on the unemployment looking s nationwide. This is when you sent out snail mail resumes. And I sent out like 360 resumes. I did get

Reza Ghaemi: Yep. Yep.

Gaylen Wilson: get one company flew me to Chicago for an interview and they loved me, but then a week later they called back and said, Well, the economy's still not where we want it to be. We're not gonna fill that position. And ⁓ and so I ended up having to go to work for Walmart as a cashier. And i after because I couldn't get a halfway decent job Because of how much money I'd been making. I actually had a had a a pretty good job with Dish Network that I went and interviewed for. But they they actually literally told me, we love you, but if that money comes back, you're gonna be gone. So we can't invest in you. And so So here I am, I had to go work for Walmart as cashier, and I worked my way up to department manager within two or three months, but they don't pay their department managers much either. And so this was all also about the time that my first marriage ⁓ disintegrated.

Reza Ghaemi: Glad you mentioned. I was just about to say, where was your wife? You know, you kind of didn't tell us what that that part of things. So yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Right, right. Yeah. My my first wife was amazing. I have nothing bad to say about her other than maybe she was too much of an enabler. If I ran out alcohol with her, she would go get me more. And and so ⁓ yeah. Yeah. Well, I don't think she was okay with it, but she was really submissive by nature.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ I see. So she was okay with your your alcoholism.

Gaylen Wilson: And you know, it did and I'm sure I became an asshole i if I ran out of alcohol. And so she rather than fight it, she just would go go do it.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay. Yep. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I see, I see. Makes sense.

Gaylen Wilson: And so between the repeated disasters and the alcoholism and and the fact that we had had four kids and were juggling the four kids and kind of had grown apart, you know, that's one of the dangers of having so many kids is you're so busy raising them that you lose each other. And and so that's about when the the first relationship or my first marriage ended after twenty three, twenty-four years, I can't remember exactly. And and so It was in the fall of 2002 that I met Heather. And she was actually the first one I dated after my marriage ended. ⁓ so I hit the jackpot right off the bat. I didn't have to go through women woman after woman after woman. And and and ⁓ so I at that point I I

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah, that's good.

Gaylen Wilson: The the rents in Denver were crazy and I still owned a house back in our little hometown in southeast Colorado and ⁓ the payments were three hundred and twenty five bucks a month and and so I I met Heather and then a year later my ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ huh.

Gaylen Wilson: My house came open, ⁓ the the renters moved out, and so I hey it's time to come home. My parents were getting getting in their seventies and so it was time to be for me to be home to take care of them too. And so they were in their late seventies at the time. And so Heather and I moved in together in our in my house in Laurent. And ⁓ and I had been s doing some studying on tantric sex. ⁓ And one of the tenets of tantric sex is eye gazing. And so eye gazing creates an incredible bond between lovers when used during lovemaking. And so we st Right, as in eye contact, you know, lovingly soft eye contact. Yeah, you know, the Bible calls it the eyes are the windows to the soul.

Reza Ghaemi: Eye gazing as in eye contact? Yep, okay.

Gaylen Wilson: And so basically in in the tantric eye gazing, you're opening your soul to each other. And and so especially during love making, it creates an incredible bond.

Reza Ghaemi: Wait, what is tell me about the Bible because I'm new to Christianity. I just I just joined

Gaylen Wilson: Okay. Yeah, the Bible says that the eyes are the window to the soul. So ⁓ huh. And so ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: Okay, yep. Yeah, okay. I see, I see, I see, yep.

Gaylen Wilson: So we we began our relationship with a ⁓ a lot of eye gazing, made an incredible ⁓ connection, and that connection actually, the eye gazing and connection and everything kept us in the ro in the romance phase for twelve years. yeah, because we we were intimate often. I had developed ED, ⁓ erectile dysfunction a at 44, and then I met Heather Heather at 46.

Reza Ghaemi: Yes.

Gaylen Wilson: And and so fortunately Viagra worked really well for me. I mean the my first lost direction, I was at the doctor that next week. I want that new little blue pill. And so it worked amazing. ⁓ you know, you've got to plan sex more with with when you're taking Viagra. So our answer was just to plan sex often. And ⁓ and so ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: Mm. Yeah. Yeah. Nice.

Gaylen Wilson: So we get twelve years down the road and ⁓ we were well let me back up a little bit because when I got got home working I had transferred with Walmart so I had a job when I hit the ground and I put a little ad in the paper for computer repair. Even though I'd never done that. I'd been a hobby I'd bought my first computer for Christmas in 1982. And I'd been a hobbyist all my life. And I'd built my own computers. And so I said, I can fix people's computers. And and you know, most of it, most of computer repair at that time was virus, killing viruses.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay. Hm. Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: And I did some mechanical repairs, but most of it was viruses. And so we we within nine months, six to nine months, the the computer repair repair was making more than Walmart was, and so I was able to quit Walmart and go full time. So from about June of of 2004 till now, Heather and I have been together pretty much 247, 365 for 22 years. You've got to really like your wife, not just love her. To be around You gotta be best friends. Yeah, she's my best friend. And so so anyway, so we got this computer repair business that's doing good. I mean, we're not making gads and gads of money, but we're living okay.

Reza Ghaemi: Wow. Good. Absolutely. Yeah, I know for sure. Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: Well then Microsoft decides it's gonna come out with Windows 7. And Windows 7, they claimed didn't get infected. It was five times less likely to get infected than Windows XP. From my experience, it was ten times more likely because we went from working on ten or fifteen computers a week to working on one or two computers a week. And so we're starving again. And so it was about that time that I discovered. to websites that were ⁓ work market work market and field nation. They're they're websites for computer techs and companies that need work orders then. And so you can go out, they put the work orders out, you go out and bid what you'll do them for. And and so we started traveling around southeast Colorado, Southwest Kansas, Texas, Oklahoma, Panhandles doing that computer field service work. And we hooked up with an outfit out of West Virginia that They had the contract with ATT, and ATT had a contract with the Farm Service Agency to provide all of its computer equipment. And so they ended up sending us all over the United States. We actually hit all 38 contiguous states within three years. Yeah. And so we had our biggest trip was we left July 6th of 2014.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ wow. ⁓ man.

Gaylen Wilson: In a brand new little Toyota Prius C, you know, the smallest Prius they make. And I built I had built a 4x4 Harbor Freight Tools trailer kit and put a Sears car top carrier on it to put our luggage in. And I took her and her 14 and 16-year-old daughters, and we drove through 35 30, yeah, through 35 states and did 250 offices in 31 states.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: at seventeen weeks and twenty five thousand miles on the road. Yeah. And so so we got home, ⁓ mid October

Reza Ghaemi: Like Wow.

Gaylen Wilson: ⁓ the girls were done with the road. They they they wanted to stay home with their or eighteen year old brother. And so we Heather and I went back out for another two or three week trip and then we got home. All the FSA offices pretty much don't do anything during Christmas, the couple weeks around Christmas, and so we got had a couple weeks off and I got really sick and And so I went into our our clinic, and again we live in a small 7500-person town. So it's hard for us to get really good healthcare professionals because we're especially because we're like 150 to 200 miles away from the big cities. And so ⁓ so the the physician's assistant I saw said, ⁓ Galen, you've got pneumonia, here's some antibiotics.

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: And he didn't do a chest x ray, which I found out later is a big huge no no. You don't diagnose pneumonia without a chest x ray. And likely had he done the chest x ray, I likely would have never had to have a heart transplant. so yeah. So anyway, ⁓ but I never did go after him. I you know I just I you know, I basically

Reza Ghaemi: Mm. Kidding me.

Gaylen Wilson: Anyway, what happened was is we had another three and a half month trip planned for January. And I had bought an oxygen generator when I had the pneumonia. And ⁓ and so we had bought a motor home to do the next trip in. ⁓ we we were tired of the Prius. And and so and Heather wanted to take her puppies with her, and so ⁓ So we left on we January, I think it was January 6th or so. The stuff coming up out of my lungs was clear. And so hey, we're good to go. And so we took off on that trip. And it was down through Oklahoma and Texas. And then we're we were gonna eventually go up through California, Oregon, and Washington and Utah on that trip. And so the further we got into that trip, the weaker and weaker I got. until six weeks into the trip. It's President's Day down in in in Corpus Christi, Texas. And I'd gotten to the point where I had a little ten pound bag of tools. I would have to carry it in and set it on the counter and suck air for a couple of minutes just to tell them why I was there. And so w we we since we had the day off, I said, let's find a clin walk in clinic and see if the pneumonia's coming back. And so we we went in and they did send me for the chest x-ray and they called me back that afternoon and said, Mr. Wilson, you don't have pneumonia. You've got congestive heart failure. You need to get home to Colorado today. And so so my bright idea, being the type A personality I am, I s that afternoon I said, Well, we'll finish this next six weeks. Because we were making three hundred dollars a job and getting three to four jobs a day in. So we were making insane money. And so so I said we'll f we'll finish the six weeks and then we'll get it taken care of. Well, the next day ⁓ we did two jobs and the reality was setting in that I had a s a serious heart problem. And so finally midday we said I said, no, we gotta go home. We we gotta go get this taken care of. And so poor Heather, she's from a town of 300 in southeast Colorado. So she doesn't do city traffic. She still doesn't do it. I have to drive in the cities. But she drove that motor home the thousand miles home.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓

Gaylen Wilson: And with me mostly laying back in the bed with the oxygen turned up as high as it would go. And I sh it did I we did have a really long cord on it, ⁓ hose on it. So I she made me come up and sit beside her when she went through San Antonio. Cause San Antonio traffic is woo. So so anyway.

Reza Ghaemi: I see. Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: So we get home to our to our little town and we go into our our hospital and it's basically a triage hospital. Anything serious, they they say, okay, Mr. Wilson, the ambulance will be here to take you to Colorado Springs. And so when we got into the ER in Colorado Springs, they did some tests, and a a normal, healthy human heart puts out 50 to 60 percent out of the left chamber every time it beats.

Reza Ghaemi: Mm.

Gaylen Wilson: Mine was putting out five percent. Yeah, I I was knocking on Best's door really hard. And so they they gave me a medicine called LASIK, which is a diuretic. It took off twenty-two pounds of water weight in two days. That's nearly three gallons of water that had been around my heart and lungs. ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: ⁓ so I the doctor was explaining it to me and I said, so in other words, my heart and lungs got in a ballroom brawl in the middle of a pool. He said, Yeah, pretty much. And so They gave me heart meds and actually by the next summer I was up to thirty percent, which is not near fifty to sixty percent, but you're feeling fairly decent. You're not running any foot races, but you can live a decent life. And and we were able to go back to making love and a couple of times a week. Not not near as much as beforehand, but we were able to still be intimate some. And

Reza Ghaemi: Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: For the first couple but then in January of the next year, my heart started going into AFib. And that's where the top part doesn't beat in synchrony with the bottom part. So when your heart's already weak and then it doesn't beat right, you're a sick man really quick. And so I had to get cardioverted several times over the next two and a half years. ⁓ you know, that that's where they in the movies you see them take the paddle and put ⁓ on and say clear and poof Well in in reality when when it's non emergency, they just put a sticker on the front of you and a sticker on the back and knock you out and then shock you back in the rhythm and then wake you back up. And so so we were still able to make love for about two years after the the virus. But

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓

Gaylen Wilson: By that time, my heart had gotten bad enough that the last year and a half it sex just became impossible. And during that those long ⁓ periods of of illness is where a lot of a lot of relationships will crumble. You know, either the either the sick person pushes the caregiver away, or the caregiver just gets so exhausted, they say, I can't do this anymore, and leave. But I think that bond that we had created during that first twelve years had taught us how to cling to each other, t return to each other and repair our you know th the we talked about the Prius. One thing that taught us was driving all the that seventeen thousand miles in a in a Toyota Prius with the ones you love, is it teaches you to say I'm sorry quickly and say I forgive you quickly. Because there's nothing quite as miserable as driving hundreds of miles with somebody you're mad at. And so so

Reza Ghaemi: Yes. Mm-hmm. ⁓ yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: That was all training for what we were about to go through. And so when we when we hit the rough times, we clung to each other. We ca actually I think we became closer. And Heather never hinted that she wanted it out. She stuck by me and nursed me and took care of me right till the end. And the end was ⁓ in May of twenty eighteen, I had my defibrillator go off and save my life. ⁓ She was rubbing my legs one night. ⁓ I've got a keeper of a wife. She has rubbed my legs or backs for twenty-three and a half years now. And ⁓ and so she was rubbing my legs and got shocked. And and then evidently my body did whoop on the bed. And sh

Reza Ghaemi: Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: She poked me and said, What just happened? And I was just coming out of it again and I said, I don't know. All I felt was, Man, I feel funky and then you're poking me. So ⁓ I had a little mouse thing that I could hold over the defibrillar and re it would read the the computer in it and then I could put it on a a ⁓ a cradle and it would send that to Denver. And so I I went back to sleep. ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: You know, 'cause I knew if we went into the little hospital that they would just send me to Colorado Springs. And so I really didn't want to do that. So I went back to sleep. Heather didn't get any sleep that night. You know, she poking me to see if I was still alive. And ⁓ and so ⁓ next morning I put it in the cradle and send it off and I call him and the guy on the other end says, ⁓ yeah, that's where the term drop dead comes from.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Because your heart rate had been two hundred and forty mi beats a minute right before that went off and shocked you back into rhythm. Had you not had that internal defibrill, you would have been dead on the spot. Yeah. So it saved my life. But then a week later my heart went back into AFib again, so I had to go to Denver and get cardioverted again. And so getting cardiovert twice in one week, once by the defibrill once by the

Reza Ghaemi: Crazy.

Gaylen Wilson: the hospital really took it out of me. I could just ⁓ I could tell I didn't have much time left. So I set ha I'd only been on the transplant list seven months and there's ⁓ there's twelve thousand people at any one time on that list, but only twenty five hundred usable hearts become available. Because, you know, it has to be a very special condition where the body's is be a able to be kept alive when the brain's dead. And so

Reza Ghaemi: Mm.

Gaylen Wilson: So anyway, I sat her down June 19th at 8 o'clock at or at 9 o'clock at night, told her, honey, I'm not gonna be here in two to three months. We need to finish getting ready. We'd been to the mortuary once, but we had some final decisions to make. And and of course she's crying her eyes out because her soulmate had just told her she he was dying on her. And she was still crying. thirty minutes later when we got the call there was a heart available. Yeah. And so so we grabbed our little to go bag like a pregnant couple keeps.

Reza Ghaemi: Great.

Gaylen Wilson: And out the door we went and we were having an eastern Colorado hail storm, rainstorm that night. So it was raining and hailing outside the car, and then the water works were still going inside the car because she had switched from crying because she was sad to crying because she was excited and and scared because there was a five percent chance I could die on that table. And ⁓ and so we They had given us to 1.30 in the morning to get up there. And we pulled into the into the par parking lot of the hospital at 1.15. So we just slid in right under the wire. And ⁓ and then they rolled me into the into the OR about four o'clock in the morning. And by nine o'clock the next morning I had a 38-year-old heart in my 61-year-old body.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Yeah and so yeah I I'm one of those I turn seventy next month and I I've got a forty-six year old heart. That's a that's ⁓ actually we were they told us to wait six weeks. We made it four because the sternum the sternum needed the heal.

Reza Ghaemi: the love making now, Galen. Mm.

Gaylen Wilson: But by four weeks I was I was feeling pretty decent with it and and so we were able to go back to making love two or three times a week. and ⁓ you know and I was sixty one years old then. So it's that was kind of unusual in itself. ⁓ there're not a lot of sixty one year olds that make love two or two or three times a week. And ⁓ and so of course I felt so blessed from for for getting another twenty plus years with my soulmate. And then also because I really love this soulmate. I mean she you know we we we've even learned how to become closer and closer and closer since the ⁓ the since the transplant. So we've g basically built a relationship now that is a refuge from all the crazy in the world. And I think that's what we all desire is that that that relationship that's a refuge rather than another thing to have to manage or another battlefield in your life. And a place where you can c you want to come home to and it's restorative instead of just another stress stress center. So ⁓ so ⁓ y I had this, you know, my type A personality again, I have this insane need to

Reza Ghaemi: Yes.

Gaylen Wilson: pay that blessing forward from the from the heart transplant. And so about three years after the transplant, ⁓ my ED was getting worse. I was getting 65, and you know, the older you get, the more blood flow issues you have and and so the ⁓ vira wasn't working as good as it used to and not as reliable. And so I joined two erectile dysfunction groups on Facebook to try to get some answers. And and I actually did get my answer. It was shockwave therapy. And it's a you can buy a little machine and it doesn't involve giving electric shocks to the penis. It it the the machines create a sound wave that's they call the shock and it travels into the penis and it

Reza Ghaemi: Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: creates micro injuries that trigger stem cells to rebuild the vessels and valves and nerves. So you basically can overhaul your penis with a machine you can get at home, use at home. So so I got so involved with those groups and especially after I had found my fix, I ⁓ after I started the shockwave ther treatments within four or five treatments, I was able to s go back to making love three to five times a week. And yeah. And by the time I had done twenty-two treatments, I was making love almost every night. And ⁓ had I had I had what ⁓ the ma the probably the best machine on the market now is about six hundred dollars. You can yeah you can get ⁓ a Chinese machine

Reza Ghaemi: How expensive are those treatments?

Gaylen Wilson: off of ebay or off of Amazon for about a hundred and eighty. and that's the one I s

Reza Ghaemi: And you're telling me as if if I don't have E D, let's say in my case I'm thirty nine and I use that, is that gonna make me like Superman or or what?

Gaylen Wilson: Mm-hmm. Well, it's it's gonna keep you from developing problems. 'Cause you're right at that age, ⁓ the statistics are that thirty percent of men in their thirties have E D and then that goes up ten percent a year or a decade, so forty percent in their four

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ So it's good for you to do it's good for me to do at this point. Okay. Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Right, right. It j it it's like taking your junk to the gym.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay, good. I can't I can't believe it it it worked for you that well. That's crazy. That's the efficacy there. Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: Yeah. Yeah. B by yeah, it it and I they the my doctor had had me up to three hundred milligrams of Viagra. ⁓ yeah, it was in combination with Viagra. Because I really think that I probably could have got off the Viagra altogether, but two of my heart meds that I have to take to keep from rejecting my heart, they also cause E D. And so ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ okay, so it was in combination of with Viagra. Yep. Mm. I see.

Gaylen Wilson: So yeah, vi 300 milligrams of Viagra is three times what Pfizer says to take. But but my but my urologist, I g I've one thing cool about being a transplant patient is you get to see the best doctors in the hospital. And so my urologist is known as their E D guru. And he he said w that with my transplanted heart and as healthy as I was that 300 milligrams was perfectly safe. And yeah.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ Mm. Okay. ⁓ good.

Gaylen Wilson: But at ⁓ towards the end I I was taking the three hand three hundred milligrams and attempting to make love a couple of times a week and failing half the time before I started the treatments. So once I started the treatments,

Reza Ghaemi: By way, is how come you never tried Cialis? I'm just curious.

Gaylen Wilson: I did try Cialis. It did nothing for me. I mean yeah, and having ⁓ administrated these I actually got made administrator of the bigger group three months after I joined and the smaller group made me administrator six months l or three months later. And so I've administrated both those groups for f over five years now. And that's one thing I've learned is where one of the meds won't work for you, the other one won't work. likely will. And there's actually a third one called the vitra that if the two don't work, sometimes it works. So it it's trial and error thing. Of course Cialis is the best because it lasts thirty six hours in your system. And so it and it allows for spontaneous sex, where Viagra only lasts four to six hours. So you've got a plan. And you've got to take it on an empty stomach or the fats in your food will tie it up and make it not work right. And so

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Mm.

Gaylen Wilson: It's a lot more picky, but it works for a lot more men than Cialis does. It's Yeah. Mhm. It

Reza Ghaemi: I didn't know you gotta take Viagra on an empty stomach. That's crazy. Like I like you're hungry while having sex. Isn't that weird?

Gaylen Wilson: I guess so if you want it bad enough. But yeah yeah, that's a mistake a lot of guys a and ⁓ it it surprised me over the years how many how few of doctors told their patients that. They c came into the group and I told them that and they said My doctor never said that. So yeah, because the fats in the food tie up the cyndophil to where it doesn't digest properly. And so

Reza Ghaemi: Mm. Yeah. Okay, okay. Got it, got it. Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: So so anyway, ⁓ so I'm administrating these two large groups, and one of my big frustrations was is that when a woman would come to the group and and actually it was hundreds of women over the five years that came to the group with the same story, she they would say, My man has developed ED and he refuses to go to the doctor. And Not only that, but he has cut me off completely from all affection. He won't touch me, he won't kiss me, he won't cuddle with me. He he he's cut me off emotionally. Anytime I say anything to him, he lashes out in anger. And yeah. And so ⁓ so I I didn't know, you know, I could just empathize with these women, which was really frustrating because, you know, I was trying to pay my blessings forward, but there was I hadn't figured out how I could help them. And so make sure I loop back around because I did figure out how to help them. But you need to hear the l next part to figure out how I got there. So the first the I got Heather and I into a course to become certified thriving relationship coaches just to fix that problem, figure out what that what that why these men were withdrawing into themselves. And so One of the first books we read was by Dr. Sue Johnson called Hold Me Tight. And in it she talks about her attachment theory. And so her attachment theory is that we were bred through thousands of years of prehistoric evolution to have an instinct for a strong attachment to our mates. That those that didn't have it didn't survive and their offspring didn't survive. And so it got brought forward into modern man as an instinct.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: Just like our instinct for alcohol is it brought got Braun as an instinct that's just as strong as our need for food or need for water. And so she went on to say that ⁓ that most of the fights we get into are not about what we're fighting about. It's about the fact that that attachment instinct has detected a threat to the attachment and has thrown our s thrown us into fight or flight mode. Just as if we were d starving to death. or dying of thirst, or in my case, not getting my alcohol. And and so once both parties get in fight or flight mode, the logical brain leaves the building. That's why you can't d communicate your way out of a fight. You know, so many relationship models say you need to learn to communicate better. Well you y when you're in fight or flight the lizard brains are in control.

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: And and and the lizard brains say things that aren't true and things that aren't meant and things that are hard to take back. And so eventually if a couple stays in that fight or flight often and never repairs it, over the weeks and months and years the emotional system takes hits and ta gets damaged. And I I've always said that there's ⁓ no sexual desire without emotional system safety, especially for women. And

Reza Ghaemi: Without emotional system safety. So then what about fights and makeup sex?

Gaylen Wilson: Well, th see that's the that's repairing the damage. Yeah, yes. And he and Heather and I used that as a repair for that twelve years. Anytime we got in a fight, we would go repair. So but ⁓ and so ⁓ so eventually if enough damage is done often enough, the couple starts to drift further and further apart. They say they still love each other.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay, okay. Okay. Good.

Gaylen Wilson: But the intimacy stops happening and eventually you get to a dead bedroom syndrome situation. Right, right. Yeah. That's that's a prime area for cheating because is especially for a woman, she's not getting her emotional needs met. And so she's really prime to cheat it in that area. And so Heather and I, even though we didn't have that problem, you know, I've always been one that

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm. And then the cheating happens maybe and things like that. Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: Good enough is never good enough. I'm always trying to tweak our relationship and make it better. And so I after we read that, I said, Hey, ⁓ let's try to figure out what we can do to stop triggering each other's attachment instinct. And so the first thing I thought about was, well, we need to watch what tone we talk to each other. Cause sometimes you talk to your loved one like they're the worst person on the planet. And and ⁓ And you get away with it because they love you, but technically you're not getting away with it because you're triggering that attachment instinct in them. And so we gave each other permission, and permission is so important in the monument method. You basically, Heather and I believe we're building this big beautiful marble monument to our relationship. And each kind word and loving gesture, or especially with when you you make love with presents. You're building onto your monument. But each cruel word, what's that? With presence. Because so many being present, yeah. So many men go into sex for being performers instead of being present. Women crave spiritual connection during love making. And so that's the problem with porn these days, is they te it teaches young men how to use women as a fancy masturbation toy.

Reza Ghaemi: Make love with make love with presence. ⁓ with presence, like being present. Okay, yes. Yes. Mm. Yes, I agree. Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: And and women don't want that. ⁓ the only women that want that are the ones that are getting paid for it. Yeah. And so

Reza Ghaemi: Seriously.

Gaylen Wilson: So we we we ⁓ so each terse word or c or cruel word or cold shoulder or fight you get into is like taking a hammer and chisel to your monument. And so we decided we wanted to fiercely protect our monument. That's the monument method institute motto is fiercely protect the monument. And you see the little monument with the swords on either side of it. It's representing the couple protecting their monument. And so you need to make your monument more important than your ego.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay.

Gaylen Wilson: and more important than being right in a fight, because nobody wins a marital fight anyway. You may w maybe win the argument, but you lose the fight. You've damaged her emotional system. And so so we gave each other permission to start calling each other out when we were using tone that wasn't necessary. You know, honey, did you really need to say that that way? And so that helped some.

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: But we were still getting in the fights. You know, as good a relationship we have, we still would fight. And we seem to be humans that wired to fight. And so I got to thinking, okay, so how do we prevent ourselves from getting in fight or flight altogether? How do we cut that off at the pass? And so I came up with the idea, hey, let's give each other a sacred word. And our sacred word is monument. And so anytime either one of us sees the other one heading towards the monument with the hammer and chisel, in other words, we've said something that's going to start the fight, the other one calls monument. And that does a couple of things. First of all, it reminds each other that our monument is more important than that fight we're getting ready to get into. And secondly, we c I called it a sacred word because we made a sacred vow that no matter how mad we were, the fight stopped right there. But When you stop the fight, you don't separate and go calm down. Because if you do that, when you come back together, you're right back at where you were. And so what we found that ca that made us stay out of fight or flight mode was when one of us calls monument, we turn towards each other, we come together and embrace each other's arms and gaze into each other lovingly into each other's eyes and patch that little spot on the monument that we just chipped out.

Reza Ghaemi: Nice.

Gaylen Wilson: And the sci- the science behind that is that when you gaze into your lover's eyes, it goes into the primal brain and says, your attachment's safe. And you can stand down. And so that's what it does. It stands you down out of fight or flight mode. The logical brain returns to the building, and you can logically discuss what you were getting ready to have a big fight about. And so as you practice this ⁓ and it does take practice. Like I said, we seem to be wired to fight. But as you practice it, the little fights just kind of go away because as soon as one of you says something that's gonna start that little fight, the other one's monumenting and you come together and you repair it instantly. You know, the best repair is the ones you don't have to make because the damage never happened. And and so and even the big fights that you used to be mad at each other for a day and a half about are over in five minutes.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Because one or the other of us realize, hey, wait a minute, our monument's more important than this, and we're coming back together and monumenting and repairing the damage quickly. So as you do this repeatedly, as you learn to do it, first of all, your nervous system learns that when eye gazing happens, it's time to stand down. So it gets easier and easier. And and then remember I was telling you that there's no sexual desire without emotional system safety. Well, this starts repairing that emotional system damage to where your your nervous system starts feeling safer and safer and safer with your partner. And all of a sudden your desire for each other blossoms. And so that's what we call the monument method.

Reza Ghaemi: That's incredible. I love it. I love that method. I personally don't need these types of methods because me and my girlfriend now, we've been dating around a few months. And I'm gonna be honest with you, ⁓ I've never been with any other woman where ⁓ how do I say this? ⁓ like it's just been perfect so far. I'm not gonna lie. So I hope it stays this way. But I'm gonna definitely keep this monument method ⁓ in mind, if I'm sure.

Gaylen Wilson: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I I I'm guessing you're gonna probably imp implement it without even knowing you're implementing it. B because y you're still in the romance phase. The real real the real test is when that those endorphins and doc ⁓ oxytocin and everything else starts wearing off. And of course we were able to keep it because we made love a lot during that first first twelve years. ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: Yes, yes for sure. We are. We are much, much so.

Gaylen Wilson: We kept returning and being close and and but that's a problem these days because a lot of relationships are built on chemistry. You know, society tells us chemistry is what to build a relationship on. And well the

Reza Ghaemi: And what's the problem with chemistry? Like when you say chemistry you're talking about like physical attraction?

Gaylen Wilson: Physical attraction, there nothing wrong with it per se, but the problem is is a lot of people will use that as the only judge ⁓ of whether a relationship should last. And and one of the big problems we have, and I'm just as guilty as as the next guy, is we with new partners we jump into bed too quick with them. And when that happens when that happens, first of all, she develops she when when she has sex, she

Reza Ghaemi: Right. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Gaylen Wilson: Her body produces oxytocin. That's the love hormone. And so she's immediately, ⁓ I love him. And so her the blinders go on and she sees no red flags that he's a raging narcissist. And conversely, the man doesn't produce the oxytocin right away. He produces dopamine, which I call the feel-good hormone. And he says, gee, that was nice.

Reza Ghaemi: Yes. Right.

Gaylen Wilson: I'd like to do that again if she'd let me. And but he bonds over that too. And so and again, it's hides the red flags that she treats wait waitresses that brong brought the wrong food as like they're dirt. And you know, those kind of little things are are what get hid by the by the hormones. And they all come forward when those hormones start to wane a little bit. And so I've actually written

Reza Ghaemi: Galen, I I I wanna I wanna kind of slightly s sort of in my opinion, the chemistry is a big part of it though.

Gaylen Wilson: ⁓ yes. I I don't I don't disagree with that at all.

Reza Ghaemi: And and I actually notice like in today's day and age, like I think the reason why people have some of these problems in relationships is because they're not truly attracted to each other on a physical and on an inner inner level. And they're just kind of dating because there's no other options for them.

Gaylen Wilson: Yeah, and that's a problem. And I've actually written a series of four books. I've got two of ⁓ published already and the other two are almost ready. ⁓ one's called Monument Man and Monument Woman, and they're for older adults that have been in a failed relationship and are getting back into this insane dating world that we've got today. And and then the younger the younger books are Man Before the Monument and Woman Before the Monument. And They're for the younger, like 16 to 25 year olds that are trying to, and their their dating market is even more screwed up than the older people say. And the fact that the most of the girls think they'd need a guy that's six foot two, makes $200,000 a year, has an eight-inch penis. I did the I I did the math on that one time, and they're talking about.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ yeah. Yeah. Thanks to porn. Yes. Yeah. Thanks to Instagram, right?

Gaylen Wilson: Point two percent of the population meet those all those check marks. So those guys are really lucky. So so yeah, you are correct. If you don't have chemistry, it's not gonna work. But if you don't build structure under that chemistry, it's not gonna work. That's why you see so many relationships that only last six months to two years.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy. Yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Because that's the typical romance phase for most relationships. And so they get to that six months to two years and all of a sudden they see who they've they've been with and they don't very very much like them anymore. And so

Reza Ghaemi: Galen, ⁓ just just to kinda say, like I have actually dinner plans ⁓ tonight. I should have mentioned at the beginning. ⁓ so if we can wrap up maybe in the next five minutes, ⁓ if that's possible, I'd love to do this again with you, but I yeah.

Gaylen Wilson: Okay. Okay. Okay. Yeah, ⁓ and I I think we do do have another episode here because we haven't even got into the sanctuary bond yet. But at that Yeah, yeah, let's do it. Because the sanctuary bond is what actually uses the monument method to build the refuge. Build that refuge and build the the

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah, I'd love to have another episode for sure.

Gaylen Wilson: And and and it then it also really insanely increases your desire for each other because you you become each other's safest place. And and when you can become each other's safest place, your desire really skyrockets. So yeah, let's do this again. ⁓ I

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah, no, it's been it's been it's been pleasure and we'll we'll yeah, we'll coordinate through I don't know, email or or the the platform that we initially met on, Bond match.

Gaylen Wilson: Okay, yeah. ⁓ so basically everybody can find me at Monument Method Institute dot com. ⁓ my my TikTok is at Monument Method. Most of my other socials are at Monument Method Institute. TikTok wouldn't let me have the institute. And ⁓ and TikTok's actually where I'm mainly con mainly building right now. And ⁓ but if you go to Monument Method Institute and ⁓

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm. ⁓

Gaylen Wilson: It's got links to my Amazon books. We've got thirty-two books on Amazon, the the relationship books, and then we've we've written eighteen romance novels that show the relationship books in love stories. So they're kind they're kind of a we've developed intervented a new genre, basically. And and also I've talked about the dating books. ⁓ I I wrote those dating books in such a way that by the time the reader gets finished with them.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ nice. Amazing.

Gaylen Wilson: They ⁓ say, okay, that's great. Where do I find somebody to build a monument with? So I've solved it with the monument validated person, MVP dating site. And you have to have read one of the books and pass a quiz on the doctrine before you can get in. And then you've got to vow that you're there to build a monument with someone. And and I'm make and as part of my pay it forward insaness, I'm making that free forever, the MVP.

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ wow, amazing.

Gaylen Wilson: And and for a limited time I've got if you go to the MVP site and scroll down to the bottom, I'm giving away monument man and monument woman. I'm getting ready to publish the other two and they'll they'll be out there shortly. I'm giving those away to try to build that community.

Reza Ghaemi: Is it? Nice, nice, Caitlyn. ⁓ and so what about your Instagram? I'm a very big Instagram kind of person.

Gaylen Wilson: I'm pretty sure I I haven't done much with it. I it's kind of a ghost town, but it it's at Monument Method Institute. So

Reza Ghaemi: Okay. And what else was I gonna ask you? ⁓ just I guess, yeah, ⁓ we're kind of out of time, but let's do this again. I'm gonna st I'm gonna hit stop on the recording, but hang tight.

Gaylen Wilson: Okay. Okay. Okay.