Bipolar Disorder Doesn’t Define Your Future: Finding Hope with Susan Johnson

Reza Ghaemi: Hello, hello, hello, hello. Welcome to the season two of the Res Podcast, the show where we have honest conversations about relationships, personal growth, mental health, and the experiences that shape who we become. As someone who lives with bipolar one disorder, I know how easy is it is to believe the diagnosis defines your future. But I also believe that accepting your condition, taking responsibility for your faith, I'm sorry, for your health, and finding meaning in your experiences can completely change the direction of your life. Today's conversation is especially personal to me because my guest and I share not only a diagnosis, but also a desire to speak openly about it and give hope to others. My guest today is Susan Johnson, a mental health advocate, inspirational speaker, and the author of Some Dreams Are Worth Keeping, a Memoir of My Bipolar Journey. Susan was diagnosed with bipolar one disorder in 1995. Since then, she has made it her mission to challenge the stigma surrounding mental health illness and show people that receiving a diagnosis does not mean giving up on their dreams. She delivered a TEDx talk titled Having a Mental Illness is Not a Death Sentence, received Healthline's Best Blogger Award in 2017, and has shared her writing through mental health and faith-based publications.

Susan Johnson: Okay.

Reza Ghaemi: She also works with special education students in Nevada. Susan, welcome to the Res Podcast.

Susan Johnson: Thank you so much. I'm super, super excited to be here with you today.

Reza Ghaemi: Amazing. I'm especially excited about this conversation because I also live with bipolar one disorder and wrote a book about how accepting my diagnosis changed my life. Although our individual journeys are different, I believe there's a lot of common ground between our messages. So, Susan, you were diagnosed with bipolar one disorder in 1995. We're now in 2026. What do you remember about that period of your life and how did you initially respond to the diagnosis?

Susan Johnson: My journey is definitely different. I feel like I was thrown into the fire, so to speak. I was on a so I had experienced ⁓ let's see. I had experienced some anxiety as a child, which I learned later were the roots. And then in junior high I experienced paranoia. And then in high school came the depression. After high school came the cruise. And that was when I had my first manic high. It was just crazy. I was dancing on tables. I was not a drinker. I'm partying, screaming, banging on this DJ's door, screaming, play red, red wine! Play it. I'm teaching guys how to dance and I'm not a good dancer. And I'm going, I mean it was just why it was not me. I went with on that cruise with a friend and we ended up having to go separate ways because she couldn't handle me. After that, I got the diagnosis because my mom is a nurse. Bipolar is genetic, it runs in the family. My uncle has it, so she knew right away. It was like, ⁓ no, when she picked me up, she's like, this is bipolar. However, I was scared to death of being in a hospital. There was no way, there's there was nothing wrong with me, right? What why do why do I need to go to a hospital? And thank God she was working through insurance, found a doctor to treat me at home, and I began lithium. And I was compliant even though I didn't understand what was going on. And so the acceptance came later when I was in college.

Reza Ghaemi: Wait, wait, talk to me about the timeline again. So so so the acceptance came later in when you were in college. How many years later that was that?

Susan Johnson: Yep. So that was n in ninety-five. Ninety five and ninety nine were the college years. Were the college year.

Reza Ghaemi: Ninety five ninety nine. But then when you say when you say the acceptance came when you were first medicated on lithium, you still hadn't accepted it?

Susan Johnson: No, I didn't understand what was going on. I was too high. I didn't understand. I wasn't seeing a psychologist either. I was just seeing the psychiatrist. So there was no education as to what was going on. But I just went with it.

Reza Ghaemi: Can you tell the listeners because 'cause to us that that makes sense to me when you say I was just seeing a psychiatrist to the listeners who might not be familiar with what the difference between a psychiatrist and a psychologist is. Can you kind of tell us what that the difference there?

Susan Johnson: The psychiatrist ⁓ writes the medication. The psychologist is the talk therapy. However, in some states they can be both, but not in Nevada.

Reza Ghaemi: Hmm. And in my experience, not both in Canada either.

Susan Johnson: Hm, interesting.

Reza Ghaemi: Well, I mean, depends on the psychiatrist, but for the most part, in my experience is having had multiple psychiatrists throughout the years, it's kind of but dependent on their personality. So I don't know if it's like a legal requirement for them, but or whether it's bra based on their personality. But you're saying in Nevada it's just not allowed.

Susan Johnson: Right, they're separate. However, my psychiatrist is different. She treats the whole person. So I'm not used she's the first one that has ever done us, so she's real special. Yes.

Reza Ghaemi: Interesting. Got it. Okay. Yeah. I see. Okay, okay. So so then it took you how many how many in and ⁓ can you tell us how long time w time wise, like months, years it took for you to accept it?

Susan Johnson: I would say Maybe even up to now, all these years.

Reza Ghaemi: Interesting. Wait a minute. What do you mean by that?

Susan Johnson: I think accepting it throughout all the journeys, throughout all the highs, throughout all the lows that life has given me. Sometimes accepting it more, sometimes accepting it less. When I hit rock bottom in Virginia, yeah, I didn't have it. Complete denial. Moved to

Reza Ghaemi: Mm.

Susan Johnson: Nevada where I live. And I think I think that probably was the point when I really, really accepted it by getting so sick, ⁓ by going off the meds, by being on the wrong meds, by being so sick I couldn't get out of bed, and ⁓ just having to make a full recovery. And I would say that's probably it.

Reza Ghaemi: Well, you kinda yada yada through that story in Virginia. Can you tell us about what happened?

Susan Johnson: Sir. So after college I had been sick and tired. I moved to Iowa kind of by force for an education. My dad got a job. He loved Iowa. He's from Iowa. They said, Well pay for your college education. By the way, I went to five colleges in four and a half years and graduated Drake University with a BA in sociology in nineteen ninety-nine. So that wa that was big. That was my one moment. I'm when I'm more than I thought I could be. As Whitney Houston sings it.

Reza Ghaemi: Amazing.

Susan Johnson: And then at that point, I was like, I nothing's happening to me in Iowa. It's depressing. These winters are killing me. I'm gonna go live my life. And I have an aunt that used to live in Virginia. She's like, Yeah, come move in with me. And I ended up getting a job before me moving in with her. And I worked in an elementary school with kindergartners, and I was an instructional assistant. At that time, I met a psychiatrist. And I blame partially him because he would not he put me on an antidepressant and that was it and I could not get a hold of the guy. So he stopped giving me the medication that I needed. And then everything just spiraled out of control. ⁓ being unmedicated at that point, abuse abused relationship, ⁓ just choices, just You know, a little bit of a car accident, couldn't hold a job, going job to job, higher than a kite, couldn't sleep at night. I mean, looking in the mirror and not recognizing myself. ⁓ my parents were have always been I've been blessed with with parents ⁓ who have helped me financially, physically, mentally, and given me faith. And they rescued me. ⁓ and I know how hard it was or I can only imagine ⁓ for them to watch me go through that and ⁓ be so far away. ⁓ but they rescued me and brought me here back to Las Vegas and I rebuilt my life, met a wonderful psychiatrist, the best of the best, ⁓ got into some therapy, found the right drugs, ⁓ And yeah, found a happiness that that I had never dreamed that I could. Met the man of my dreams.

Reza Ghaemi: Yes. Okay, okay. So what what was the how many years later was this that you went back to Las Vegas, Nevada?

Susan Johnson: Okay, so that was two thousand and one to the present.

Reza Ghaemi: To the present, 2001 to the present. Okay, okay. Boy. and I assume that you mentioned your family was very supportive. Same with my family, by the way. I'm so blessed. I don't even know, Susan. What do people do with this condition? Type one, especially, who don't have that? What do they do?

Susan Johnson: I feel so bad for them. I feel so bad for them. find friends, a pastor, therapist, just someone who will listen to you. You know, there's there's suicide lines on international bipolar foundation. I've I'm writing my second book. I found all these resources around the world that people can go to.

Reza Ghaemi: Same.

Susan Johnson: And it's just there there's hope out there. You just have to find it and there's help. But you gotta look for it.

Reza Ghaemi: Yes, you gotta want it. Exactly. okay. Well, thanks for sharing all that, ⁓ Susan. ⁓ I'm just listening to it and getting goosebumps a little bit because it's like I can relate so much to everything you're saying. ⁓ so just so you know, my book is called Bipolar is my superpower, but that does not mean I ignore the destructive and painful side of the illness. How do you personally understand your relationship? with bipolar disorder today. Are there qualities in yourself such as creativity, empathy, determination, or sensitivity that have shaped that have been shaped by your experiences? That makes sense.

Susan Johnson: I'd say all of the above, so pick one. No. I say I would like I think working in my school, I work with children that have ⁓ special needs and it's more learning disabilities and I also had a learning disability which was really bipolar growing up and school was very, very hard for me.

Reza Ghaemi: Ha ha ha.

Susan Johnson: And I can relate to my students in a way that I feel like nobody else can, and I can be a bright light for them in their darkness.

Reza Ghaemi: 100%. And ⁓ yeah, I know that's super cool that you get to do something that is so relatable. And I'm actually going into this addictions and mental health counseling field myself. ⁓ TMI, but ⁓ it's starting in September 14th. It's a program. So thank you so much. Yeah. After writing the book, I I finally figured out this was something that I'm passionate about doing and

Susan Johnson: So I think that's pretty cool. Congratulations.

Reza Ghaemi: And I I could never find a therapist that had lived experience. Maybe I just didn't search long enough, but it's rare.

Susan Johnson: I don't have one. I've never had one that have lived experience. But let me tell you, I have the best of the best. There has been two, Doctor Ziggy, she's in the book, n named Doctor Ziggy, and think we have ⁓ crossed over through the years since the book came out and we're now friends. So that is like the biggest

Reza Ghaemi: That's amazing. That's amazing. No way.

Susan Johnson: blessing and we went on a retreat together last ⁓ spring. A silent retreat. Well she made me talk. I blame her on our silent retreat. But I mean she's a text away and it's just she's such a I mean I'm here because of her. I don't think I would have made it. yeah yeah they

Reza Ghaemi: Mm-hmm. I'm so so happy to hear that. Now, Susan. Yeah, yeah. Sorry, were you saying something? ⁓ I think just listening to your story and this is not a show about politics or anything. I don't want it to misconstrued. My I just I was born in the US. So I'm familiar with health insurance and coverage. And and to be honest with you, my diagnosis came in twenty eighteen when I lived in Canada.

Susan Johnson: Yep, good. Yep.

Reza Ghaemi: As a Canadian citizen, I'm a dual citizen, Canadian and American. But if this something happens to an American who doesn't have health insurance, do you happen to know like what would even happen with somebody who had doesn't have any health insurance?

Susan Johnson: Medicare, Medicaid, ones for the older people, ones for people that don't have the the resources, the insurance. But my father is a hospital administrator and he drilled it into my head that every job that I took, I had to have medical insurance. No matter what it was, because

Reza Ghaemi: I see, I see. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Susan Johnson: Without it, y I can't get my medicine, I can't see my doctors. I'm I'm bl I'm blessed. Yeah.

Reza Ghaemi: So important. It's so important to have that because people don't realize, ⁓ yeah, you're a healthy individual. You don't need this health insurance. And there's something called invisible disorders that we go through. And yeah. Okay. ⁓ so so talk to me about this. I'm just curious to know because the reason why I called the book that I wrote. And I know this is not a show, this is about you. This is not about me, but I want to get your take on this. I called it my superpower, not because I'm glorifying the mania, God forbid. I am saying this is a superpower because I have this condition and now in recovery, I have to work on myself more than somebody that doesn't have this. So that is a superpower. Now I'm talking to you about CBT and DBT and. All this nerdy psychology stuff, whereas the average person may may not have to do that. So that's the superpower for me. Is that relatable to you in any kind of way? Do you kind of what's your take on that?

Susan Johnson: Absolutely. You know, this illness takes sacrifice, as you were saying. My family's coming into town, well, my in-laws are coming into town this week. And because I have an early start time, I have to take my medicine at 6 p.m. Six PM to get up at five thirty. So I have to sacrifice my self care. in order to do my job effectively to get that sleep because I need that eight to ten hours sleep or I can't give anything to any kid or any teacher during my workday. So we're not going to be able to see them, unfortunately. We couldn't get to schedules together. So things like that. I I'm not able to go out during the week. A lot of people like, ⁓ we went to this concert last night. And we had this great time and I'm like in bed at eight. But you gotta do what you gotta do.

Reza Ghaemi: For sure, for sure. ⁓ and ⁓ in terms of I guess my next question for you, Susan, is what has helped you create a successful and meaningful life with managing bipolar disorder one? You just mentioned it, you're kind of being responsible about your sleep. But what about faith? What role has faith? Because I know me, I mentioned this before I hit the recording. ⁓ faith has been a big part of me, my journey as well with this. Can you talk to us about that?

Susan Johnson: ⁓ it's my anchor. I wouldn't be here without it. It sustains me every single day, every single moment. My faith does. ⁓ I'm a Catholic and I rely on it. I read the Bible. I pray with friends. What's that?

Reza Ghaemi: I'm Catholic Light, by the way. I'm Catholic Light. Anglican.

Susan Johnson: Very good, very good choice. ⁓ yeah, I just came from church this morning. ⁓ in it yeah.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah. Nice. I missed it today. I missed it today. I was just I didn't get enough sleep last night, so I couldn't go. But I don't want to be one of those people that falls asleep in church and that's not good.

Susan Johnson: And like I was saying, ⁓ I go on a silent retreat once a year with at a convent with nuns. So that's always ⁓ an interesting experience, but I I look forward to that every year. a priest comes, he does talks, and it's just there's gardens and I just find a peace that the world can't give. And I don't know how people do it that don't have faith.

Reza Ghaemi: Seriously. ⁓ question for you was so for me, every time I had a manic episode, I've had three manic episodes in my in my life, and that was all because I I never I stopped taking the medication. That's the only reason why that happened. But the reason I bring this up is because for me, faith was a big part of the episodes. I became very spiritual. Did that happen to you during the episodes?

Susan Johnson: I think the first one I would say it's like God was in the same room as me. I don't know if you you it was like I was like wow this is cool like you know he's like right there. You know, I would I I'm like I didn't did you have psychosis? I never have like no psychosis. ⁓ I'm blessed. No, I'm so blessed. No.

Reza Ghaemi: First one. Exactly. I know. Yes, yes, no. ⁓ you never had that. ⁓ so yours was hypomania.

Susan Johnson: Yeah. Psychosis. No psychosis.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay, no, I definitely th the first episode I didn't have psychosis, but the sec the number two and number three I did have psychosis, yes.

Susan Johnson: ⁓ that's that's rough.

Reza Ghaemi: But Susan, I did a lot of drugs, so I don't know. I did a lot of drugs. Yeah. Yeah. It it might yeah. Yeah. That might have had to do with the the reason why my episodes were psychosis based. So I don't know. But yeah.

Susan Johnson: ⁓ see I've never, never touched a illegal drug in my life. And I never will. I'll never smoke pot. Yep, stay away from drugs. Don't do Yeah. Say no.

Reza Ghaemi: Yes, yes. Whoever's listening, seriously. It's true. cool. But no, but your your work includes a strong message about hope, and you have also written for faith based publications. So have there been moments when your faith was tested by your by the illness?

Susan Johnson: So many moments. So many moments. Those depressions. The the ones in Iowa specifically. ⁓ I live in Nevada and the sun is good for me. You know, my climate, I think that that that makes the difference. The the sunshine. In Iowa, those those winters are hell. I mean you couldn't even breathe the air. Maybe you can relate to this where you live, but you you go outside and it's like negative dirty something and it hurts to breathe. So you're you're you're in your house and you can't even leave. And that's when the depress depressions hit. It was it was awful. Also moving when I moved to here to Nevada and I was very sick, the depressions, I I couldn't get out of bed. And it was at that time my father shared his faith with with me for the first time ⁓ in my entire life. And he reminded me as I was laying there in that bed, not wanting to live anymore. He said, Susie, was my nickname, what about your faith? ⁓ yeah, God didn't leave me, even though it feels like he did. He never left me, not for one moment. And he never will.

Reza Ghaemi: That's beautiful. That's beautiful. yeah, no, for me, it it's the same thing. ⁓ I I as you said, I don't know how people do it without it. For excuse the pun, but it's crazy how they do it without it. ⁓ Well, ⁓ my goodness. ⁓ I'm kind of I'm trying there's so much to talk about. ⁓ Talk to me, talk to us about your book a little bit. ⁓ to the listeners. ⁓ so your book is called Some Dreams Are Worth Keeping, Which Dreams Did Bipolar Disorder Threaten to Take Away From You? And how did you decide which dreams were still worth pursuing?

Susan Johnson: Okay, the book was never supposed to be read by anyone. It was a healing journey for me. Took years to do, you know, so I had no intention of anybody reading these personal tell it like it is mistakes, embarrassing things, and you know, just so I worked through the book and I found healing. I found a healing because I was running from a past and things kept creeping up through songs, memories, dreams, and I knew that writing would be therapeutic. So I took a writing how to write a memoir workshop, met a 90-year-old man, and ⁓ he became my mentor. And he encouraged me for three years. And then he gave me the encouragement and said, You have talent. You need to share this story with the world. You'll make it. And it was traditionally published originally. So that's a little bit of background. And then once people started reading it, it was terrifying. I mean, can you imagine you having mom and dad like know like everything?

Reza Ghaemi: ⁓ wow.

Susan Johnson: And you know, my husband reading it and my brother, I mean yeah, I had some sleepless nights. But let me tell you, it's been worth it. I've people from around the world are reading this. I've I get responses and it's it's a lot from family members. Thank you for writing this. Now I understand what my son or daughter is going through as a result of you sharing your stories. And I never thought it would have that impact ever. So it's act so bad I didn't.

Reza Ghaemi: And yeah, totally, totally. I'm so glad you did it too. ⁓ Susan, well, for somebody that's listening to this right now and they're still very much afraid if what if what if somebody finds out that I have this? Because this is what happened with me for many years. I was one of those people that was very afraid of like my co-workers finding out. a person I went on a date with, what if they see the bottle of medication on my mirror drawer? What would you say to those people? Can you give some tips and advice? How should they

Susan Johnson: That was also me. I want to share it. That was also me. It was my dirty little secret. My parents were like, you cannot tell your principal. You know, ⁓ you will get, you know, retaliation. You think she will look at you differently. You cannot tell anyone. You just you can't. And that's a big what's that?

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah, yeah. Your parents would say that. Your parents would say that.

Susan Johnson: Yeah, to me. And that's a big load. Yeah. That's a big load to carry. Isn't it?

Reza Ghaemi: Same, same with my parents. My parents too. Yeah. ⁓ my gosh, you have no idea. ⁓ my gosh.

Susan Johnson: And there's no shame in this. There isn't, you know, we were beautifully made in God's image and lightness. There is no shame in what we live with. You know, people have diabetes. That was always, it's a metal con condition. Take medicine, correct? We have a metal con a medical condition. We take medication. And I found out.

Reza Ghaemi: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

Susan Johnson: I I remember telling my coworker at school, I've been at my same school for 19 years. And I literally was like whispering it. You know, I was like, I have bipolar disorder. And they're like, what? Because honestly, I'm very proud of this. I'm probably one of the last people in the school that you would think that has bipolar disorder.

Reza Ghaemi: I totally understand. I totally understand.

Susan Johnson: So that's it's pretty cool, right? I get away with this. So those meds are working. So take those meds.

Reza Ghaemi: That's exactly right. I totally understand what you just said. It's like we are quote unquote supposed to appear to be the crazy ones, but we are not the crazy people. We're actually more normal. It's crazy how that is, but like I am a very normal person if I'm on the medication, I gotta say, right? Is that what you're trying to say?

Susan Johnson: Mm-hmm. Take those meds.

Reza Ghaemi: Okay. Okay. Yeah. Take those meds. Take those meds. Whoever's listening, it takes a little bit of a while to find the ones that work for you, but yeah.

Susan Johnson: Yeah. And I think and I think that's really hard with all the side effects. You know, people are like, you know, I tried this, I tried that. You have to try a lot, but once you've found that cocktail, you know, it's gold. It's worth it.

Reza Ghaemi: Yes. Absolutely. Absolutely. ⁓ well, Susan, time flies when you're having a good time. It's been 27 minutes. ⁓ I want to respect your time and the audience's time. If someone listening today feels ashamed of their diagnosis or believes that bipolar disorder has disqualified them from having a meaningful life, what would you want to say directly to that person?

Susan Johnson: It's a lie. You can live your dreams. You can find love. I've been married ⁓ 20 years next month. You can have you can follow your hearts. Don't let this illness define the type of life, the type of person that you are. There's always light at the end of the tunnel. You just have to look for it. You have to look for it in small things. You have to look for it in nature. You have to look it for in the cat that I love. In the husband, in the friend. You just you have to be aware. And never, never, never give up. Never.

Reza Ghaemi: My God, I love that so much, Susan. It's been so awesome to have you on the show. and thank you so much. I hope that somebody listening to this, you have, in my opinion, so heartfelt. Your message is I'm gonna make a difference to somebody that's listening. I wish that I had the opportunity to to listen to this type of thing when I was first diagnosed. It would have helped me so much. yeah.

Susan Johnson: Same.

Reza Ghaemi: Well, ⁓ Susan, your book, ⁓ I'm gonna order it on Amazon. although I'm more of an audiobook guy, but hopefully it's an easy read. ⁓ yeah, yeah.

Susan Johnson: Yeah, I've gotta get that on audio. I've gotta get it on. In old school. It came out ⁓ twenty fifteen. So it's just one of those things. I am writing book two that I hope to be launched next summer. So it's exciting too. Yeah.

Reza Ghaemi: Mm. I see. ⁓ amazing. Amazing. Well yeah. okay. Well Susan, thank you again for being here. I'm gonna hit stop on the recording. But don't go anywhere yet. It was it was my honor.

Susan Johnson: It was an honor. Okay. It w it was such an honor. Thank you.

Reza Ghaemi: Thank you so much, Susan. Don't go anywhere yet.